Editor’s Note: Dan Gable, who won NCAA and Olympic championships as a wrestler and led the University of Iowa to 15 NCAA team titles in 20 years before retiring in 1997 will offer his legendary point of view on the current state of wrestling on a regular basis with WIN. Gable spoke to WIN editor Mike Finn on Nov. 25.

WIN: The NWCA All-Star Classic was recently held where results are not supposed to count for and against someone’s record. Is there such a thing as an exhibition when it comes to wrestling?

GABLE: In some guy’s minds, it can be an exhibition, but usually those are guys who I want on the other team. You see it in pro football, pro baseball and pro basketball, where money is one of the driving factors in how you play. In an individual sport, it is pretty tough compared to a team sport. In an individual sport, where you have pride and not just driven by money, then chances are I’m going to put out.

There are some people think the winner of an All-Star meet would feel good and the loser might say, “Oh well, I can beat him next time.” That’s usually a false pretense because in wrestling, you don’t want the guy to beat you.

What you don’t want to fight in someone is a confidence thing. You want to eliminate that confidence factor because confidence usually means that he is tougher. I can remember wrestling a guy in college at 137 in the Big Eight finals. A national champion named David McGuire, the defending national champion from Oklahoma went up a weight to 137 in the Big Eight tournament, where I had my way with him. But when it came to the NCAAs, he dropped back to 130 pounds, which you could do in those days. I decided to cut down to 130 for the first time that year because my high school coach — Bob Siddens — convinced me to do it. So I met the guy in the national finals that year and he was tougher in that match even though I had just beaten him the week before.

WIN: Have you ever wrestled an exhibition? If so, how did you treat it?

GABLE: I treated it like it was a match. It was against Gene Davis, a national champ fromm Oklahoma State and Olympic team bronze medalist. He was wrestling for Athletes in Action and I was at Iowa State. It was a tough match and I beat him by 3-4 points. If I would not have been on my game, I would not have beaten him.

WIN: What was your mindset in that match?

GABLE: There was no difference. In was in the Armory and we had a good crowd. I didn’t take it as an exhibition match.

WIN: Should wrestling count all-star match results on a wrestler’s career won-loss record?

GABLE: That’s out of a lot of people’s hands. A lot of people say it should count, but because we are so limited (by the NCAA) on number of competitive dates, we can’t affort to count them. We only get 16 dates. Take a look at how many dates volleyball or basketball has. If we had to count those matches, we would not even hold the event.

WIN: Is it too early in the season for a wrestler to wrestle in such a match against a highly-ranked opponent?

GABLE: No. I think it is exciting because it allows us to kick off the season with something of unique importance. I think it gives guys a measuring stick early on of where they are at after four months (of the off-season). I don’t think there is anyone out there protecting anything. It sets a good tone and tells a lot of kids I better get serious or I’m doing well.

WIN: Is the new way of determining NCAA qualifiers good?

GABLE: I don’t know. It’s too soon to say. If someone would have asked me if we should do this, I would have said no. There is a lot of buzz about it. We really won’t know until we go through it for a year or two or three to say, “We went the wrong direction.” I know I like the control being with the athlete and not with some outside group saying we have to have this criteria. There is always a complaint when it comes to determining qualifiers.

WIN: The NCAA recently held a teleconference looking for ways to improve the national tournament. What recommendations would you make?

GABLE: It’s pretty darn good right now. I would want to increase the attendance so that there is a waiting list. There is always an angle to sell something. In the up-coming dual between Iowa and Iowa State, you have No. 1 vs. No. 2.

WIN: In two years, the NCAA will be in Philadelphia. What needs to be done to make that one memorable?

GABLE: Every time you have a great tournament, no matter where you take it, you chances of having even a greater tournament is better. Gimmicks can draw people but getting out sport more nationally known to the media is happening slowly. We are losing ground every day because of the sports above us.

WIN: Iowa was once accused of hurting the sport because you dominated the NCAAs for nearly ten years? Is the sport hurt by one dominant team?

GABLE: I don’t think a lot of people know what to respect. Iowa is good for the sport. Iowa State is good for the sport. Oklahoma State is good for the sport. When has it been said that Ohio State is think about winning a national title. Or how about Missouri. Where did they come from? Or how about Nebraska?

WIN: Are you saying, “Don’t worry about one team. Instead, worry more about the other teams finding a what to be as dominant?

GABLE: I think that is what’s happened. There were a few teams that threw the towel in. I don’t see anyone throwing the towel in because there are so many more competitive coaches now.

WIN: Are there more competitive coaches today than during your time?

GABLE: There are a lot more people who are really thinking they can win right now. Iowa State believes they can be in there after pushing to the wire the last few years. In my day, maybe there were more teams that settled for second place. That’s not quite as much motivation. There were times during the season that we showed vulnerability. There were times that we had a let up. Maybe that’s why we peaked at the end.

WIN: Let’s talk about today’s different styles of wrestling. One thing that is happening is that when someone gets a good shot, the other person dives down to the leg to create at least a stalemate or potentially dangerous. What are your thoughts on that?

GABLE: It’s simple. You just have to learn how to finish better. When someone dives, there is no way in heck if you are in a good position that you can’t finish where you should be.

WIN: What aren’t they finishing better?

GABLE: Because they are out of position. If there is any position to dive, that means you are not in good position to finish. You are doing the wrong technique from an offensive point of view. If they get your foot, that means your foot was out in front and it’s not supposed to be out in front. You are the offensive man, in charge. If there is a defensive guy who goes to an offensive move, he’s the second man in charge.

WIN: Are you saying that fundamentals are not as good?

GABLE: People have seen there are things that they can do. I’m not so sure to see that kids are going after it on the first ditch. Maybe they should be going to their fundamentals first and they wouldn’t be in so much danger.

WIN: Are wrestling moves better today than when you wrestled?

GABLE: The opportunity is there to be better. There are always more chances to wrestle. It’s more scientific. There is more information to get better. You just have a chance to watch everyone in the world wrestle. You learn from people in the best systems. There are no more kept secrets. It comes down to the technical aspect.

WIN: What is the best “ageless” move in wrestling; a move when done well will succeed in any era?           

GABLE: Leg tackles are something that has always been there in a wrestling match. It’s the most simple fundamental scoring maneuver in wrestling. There are tie-ups, but it’s tie-ups to leg tackles. It’s still a setup that set up leg tackles.

WIN: What was your favorite move as a wrestler?

GABLE: I loved it when the referee slapped the mat on my opponent. I loved the arm bars while being on top. I also loved the near arm-far leg while on my feet. You could end up in the leg tackle and put a guy straight to his back. That’s the best move that (Tom) Brands used and the best move that (Brent) Metcalf uses today. With the thousands who wrestle, there are only a few who can do that. When people ask me about special wrestlers, I could name them on one or two hands. They don’t come around every day.

WIN: If you there are five things that a wrestle has to be good at to succeed, what would they be?

GABLE: 1. You have to be able to compete. 2. You have to be able to listen, which should probably be the first thing. 3. You have to be motivated. 4. You have to learn how to train for the sport, which is different than learning how to compete, which is the never give-up attitude. It’s very hard to compete in our sport. 5. You have to learn how to recover from the first four things to start over and be motivated again. It’s kind of a cycle.

WIN: You didn’t say anything about weight cutting.

GABLE: Weight-cutting is under “how to train” for the sport. I don’t believe in weight cutting. I believe in nutrition and weight management. If you are in the wrong weight class because this guy is bigger than you and you’re not winning, then get in the right weight class.

WIN: What’s better in wrestling: a strong drive or having good technique?

GABLE: Attitude and drive. I don’t know how you are going to learn technique without a strong drive.